Transcript

Today's Issues continues on AFR with Ed Vitagliano

>> Ed Vitagliano: Today's Issues continues on AFR with your host, Ed Vitagliano. And welcome back to Today's Issues at Battagliano City. And for Tim Wildmon this week, joined in studio by Fred Jackson and Tony Battagliano, Chris Woodward has gone to his cave. And now out amongst the rest of us is Steve Paisley Jordal, who has gone. This is just the second Paisley shirt that I. That's. This is new, right? Yeah, I've seen.

>> Steve Jordahl: I got a couple of them, and, yeah, I'm rotating them in on a, you know, basis. Thank you.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Is. It's brightly colored.

>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Happy Monday. Happy Columbus Day.

>> Steve Jordahl: Absolutely.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Shirt.

>> Steve Jordahl: Yeah. All right, welcome, everybody.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I like about those kind of shirts is if you spill something on it while you're eating, you don't have to write into the dirty clothes.

>> Steve Jordahl: Right.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Eyes can't focus.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Ah, yeah, that's a little tomato sauce. That's a little cheese dip from the Mexican restaurant.

>> Steve Jordahl: That's right.

>> Ed Vitagliano: You can't see it. All right.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Same thing with a black shirt, though.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Also a black shirt. Well, you don't.

>> Tony Vitagliano: You can't see the stains.

>> Steve Jordahl: Oh, you can.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Some stains you can.

>> Steve Jordahl: Some you can.

>> Ed Vitagliano: I don't. There's not too much I eat that wouldn't show up on a black shirt. But I like the way you're thinking, yeah, got to hide these things. So I. I saw somebody in the, kitchen last week. This is the difference between guys, between men and women. One of the many differences. So women, we have an ice machine. So, you know, you can get water, have ice water or tea, whatever. And so it was a lady that dropped some ice on the floor, and she actually picked it up and threw it in the sink. And I said, a guy would have just kicked that under the refrigerator. You don't have to bend over.

>> Steve Jordahl: That was my first thought.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Kick that under the fridge.

>> Tony Vitagliano: I don't do that at home.

>> Steve Jordahl: No.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Yes. Publicly.

>> Steve Jordahl: Other guys would do it.

>> Tony Vitagliano: I don't do that.

>> Steve Jordahl: Other guys would do it, not me.

>> Ed Vitagliano: All right, Steve.

There has been some talk about whether Charlie Kirk supported Israel before his death

>> Steve Jordahl: All right. you guys teased us a little bit last, hour. there has been some talk, about Charlie Kirk and whether or not he truly supports Israel or supported Israel before his death. And I want to just go over this a little bit because the information is kind of going around. And it started when Candace Owens, on her podcast, read a text, stream between Charlie and several other, people of his friends. It was a private text stream, and Candace outed it. And this is after Charlie had passed away. Now, I preface this by Saying Candace, there is not a conspiracy theory, that she doesn't embrace it twice. She has gone off the deep end on some of these. I'm not even going to mention mentioned some of them. But, this is what she read. And, it was confirmed by Andrew Colvett, who is Turning Point. He was Charlie Kirk's chief of staff. So, let's listen to cut 13. This is Candace Owens reading this text.

>> Speaker D: So Charlie writes in this group chat, just lost another huge jewish donor. 2 million a year because we won't cancel Tucker. I'm thinking of inviting Candace. Somebody writes, oh, Charlie writes, jewish donors play into all of the stereotypes. I cannot and will not be bullied like this, leaving me no choice but to leave the pro Israel cause.

>> Steve Jordahl: Leave the pro Israel cause is what he wrote. and again, Andrew Colvett says that is a legitimate. He had seen that he had not released it because it wasn't his release, although he did give it to law enforcement because it was released. he knew about it and they took a while to get. The killer, alleged assassin wanted all information. They wanted all the information out there. So, so, yeah, so now everybody's saying, what did Charlie Kirk really support Israel? And there's a whole contingent. There's a lot, several people, Tucker Carlsen, Candace Owens, and others that have a. Some would say anti Semitic, some would say less nuanced position on support for Israel. Well, I want you to hear some of what the background is of this from Charlie himself. This is him. This was on the Charlie Kirk show, which is now being hosted by Andrew Colvett. And they played this clip of Charlie being a little frustrated. Cut 18.

>> Charlie Kirk: The behavior by a lot, both privately and publicly, are pushing people like you and me away. Not like we're gonna be pro Hamas, not like we're gonna. But we're like, honestly, the way you are treating me is so repulsive. I have text messages, Megan, calling me an anti Semite. I am learning biblical Hebrew and writing a book on the Shabbat. I honor the Shabbat, literally the Jewish Sabbath. I visit Israel and fight for it. And, there's another article out in the Times of Israel today. I could read it on air. I was just reading before I got on. Charlie, what are you doing? Like, why are you. What am I doing? I'm sorry. Like, let's just take a step back here. Like, I'm an American citizen. Yes, I want Israel to win. Yes, I'm a Christian. But, like, the sum of the mess. And you saw me, you've seen. I've been treated, Meghan. By some.

>> Speaker F: Not all.

>> Charlie Kirk: By some, no.

>> Steve Jordahl: It's very irritating. So, to review, a Jewish donor or two, said they're going to pull funding of more than a million dollars from his America Fest. His, Pro. It's a gathering that's sponsored by Turning Point and he was going to invite Tucker Carlsen and maybe Candace Owens. They said, if you're going to invite them, we're going to pull our money. And that was his. He didn't feel like being bullied. Did he support Israel? Let me read you a paragraph from the first paragraph in the letter that Charlie Kirk wrote to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu before he died, obviously. And, this was a long letter with some tips on how to better message, social media. But this is what he opened up. One of my greatest joys as a Christian is advocating for Israel and forming alliances with Jews in the fight to protect Judeo Christian civilization. Most recently, I'm proud to have taken over Ambassador Huckabee's show on tbn, where we continually support Israel and the Jewish people. As Mohammedism spreads into Western societies, it's critical that Jews and Christians stay united in the effort to contain and roll back radical Islam and Sharia law. I regret to report the anti Israel and anti Semitic trends are at record levels on social media. These negative sentiments, then flow downstream into college campuses and even seep into conservative MAGA communities, leaving no doubt that he really did support Israel.

Charlie Kirk disagreed with Tucker Carlson on the Israel issue

I have one more clip to play you. And this is Andrew Colvett kind of explaining what his view of what's going on. Cut 14.

>> Speaker F: Attacking him. He would, you know, he would, he would not air any dirty laundry or, frankly any disagreements he had with people. He did disagree with Candace on the Israel issue. He disagreed with Tucker on the Israel issue. But he also recognized Tucker had positions they agreed on. Tucker was a useful voice in the conservative movement on many things. And so he invited him to events and you know, they were popular events. And so he would react. Sometimes people would just say, yeah, don't invite him or we're going to, you know, cut off some large donation. And that would make him angry. He would say this. Yeah, as you say, this is moral blackmail. And he's this, he's this Scottish guy. He's combative.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, Fred, I want our listeners to know we talked about last week whether to cover this issue, because I think we were all in agreement. It's not. I don't like the idea of airing Something that puts, possibly puts words into Charlie's mouth or thoughts into his head when he can't defend himself. The guy was murdered. He's assassinated. But this, this story is out there.

>> Fred Jackson: Yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And our listeners are, They've probably seen it on social media. It's probably not going away. Generally, I like Tucker Carlsen, but he has veered into areas that I'm, sad to see him go. I don't care much for Candace Owens anymore because as you said, Steve, well put. There isn't a conspiracy theory out there that she hasn't adopted twice, whatever your words were. But we, we are also a news organization and we at times have to talk about issues that we're not comfortable talking about. So we decided we wanted to cover this on Monday, which is now today.

>> Fred Jackson: Yeah. I mean, it's been verified that social media posting, that Charlie was frustrated by, some groups that said they would withdraw their support if he had Candace Owens or if he had Tucker Carlsen speak at one of his events. Those are just the facts.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Fred Jackson: that doesn't make him an anti Semite.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right.

>> Fred Jackson: because you don't. I think, you know, I won't be bullied. In other words, I'm not going to. My favor is not going to be purchased or I'm not going to sell my favor, which is an honorable stand, to take. Having said that, I think it may be a lesson to other groups that might have various groups coming in to speak. You need to be sure. If you're a strong advocate for Israel and you invite someone in who is not, let's say, a strong advocate for Israel, your organization is going to be painted with that brush. So you just have to be careful of those sorts of things. Charlie Kirk is no longer with us, so we can't get his opinion, context and all that sort of thing. So it's just, it's a lesson on both. Be careful what you put down on social media. You know, you're frustrated about something. I'm just going to go crazy with this. So we need to be careful. You know, that's a lesson in that. But also, we don't want to paint Charlie Kirk as being anti Israel because of this.

>> Ed Vitagliano: And Tony, one other thing too, to keep in mind is that Charlie might have been wrestling with this issue and it's not fair for us to freeze him in time and say when he says one of the things he said was, you know, may have to leave the pro Israel camp, does, that mean he's. Because he explains. He's. That doesn't mean I'm going to be in favor of Hamas or anything like that. Maybe what it means is I'm not going to say thumbs up to everything Israel does. I want to have the right to criticize them like we do with our country.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yes.

>> Ed Vitagliano: You know, so this is why we, we kind of struggled a little bit with this. Because by talking about it now, when Charlie's gone, does not give him the freedom to work through his own frustrations and tell us what he's thinking on the other side of that. Wrestling.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yeah, this is, to me, this is a distraction and a necessary distraction to take away from, the root cause of or the root issue that led to Charlie Kirk's assassination, which is radical leftist, ideology. And hey, to me, this is a distraction.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Whether.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Whether Charlie Kirk was wrestling with, nuanced views of Israel, Israeli foreign policy or not is, Is to me is irrelevant. Unless, like, what Candace Owens and others try to do is they try to make connections that aren't there. That's the only reason this is becoming, this has come into focus, is because people want to make, connections that, are conspiracy theories. I'm not, I'm not even going to go into them here. I'm sure, like I said, if you're on social media, you've, you've probably seen some of the views espoused. So to me, it's a distraction because I don't know what the issue is with somebody having a more nuance. I mean, people are complex. Charlie Kirk's a deep thinker. He likes to think through things. He likes to take counsel from people. people are complex. So it's okay to have a nuanced view on, the foreign policy of another country. Does it make, like you said, just because he doesn't agree with everything, May not have agreed. You know, again, we don't know what specific issues he's talking about. But just because he wouldn't agree with every foreign policy decision that Israel would make or strategic decision they would make doesn't make him anti Semitic or anti Israel. No more than when, like you said, we make criticisms of American foreign policy. I'm, I'm one of our biggest critics. Sometimes. Does that make me un American? No, it just means I have a nuanced view and take every decision we make. Foreign, boy, that's foreign policy, domestic, economic, and I'm making a judgment on that. It doesn't make me anti American.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, folks, we did want to, bring this topic up because you're probably. You either have heard or will hear of this on social media, maybe discussed in your Sunday school class or what have you. So we want. We do follow these issues and want to address them when we think it's appropriate to do. All right. All right, Steve.

A Southern Baptist pastor started a church in the Marshall County Correctional Facility

>> Steve Jordahl: All right. A, week ago Sunday, my wife and I went to visit a friend who is leading a revival service to music. At a revival service was actually a Southern Baptist, area meeting, general, meeting. And, my buddy that used to lead music was doing the music there. So we went, sang the choir and everything. And in the middle of this service, a man gets up. They invite a guy to the stage, and he gets up, and he's wearing prison garb. And on the back of his shirt it says MDOC convict. It says Mississippi Department of Corrections convict. And he gets up there and is introduced as Pastor Michael Knox, but he likes to be called Rip. And, he has started a Southern Baptist church in the Marshall County Correctional Facility. I went to church with them last night or yesterday. Was that just last night? Sunday night? Saturday night? Saturday night, 7:30 Saturday night. And shout, out to the men there at Marshall County Correctional Facility. They were so kind to us. A lot of them listen to afr and I, got the story.

Pastor Rip came to know Christ in prison through a Bible

I want to bring you the story of Pastor Rip, and his church. It's just fascinating. First of all, how did he get the nickname Rip? I thought. I never asked him what he was in for. And what he did. I was thinking, did he rip a guy's beating heart out of his chest or something? No.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Your mind went right there.

>> Steve Jordahl: I know it did. It did. No, he's called Pastor Rip because it means really invested in people. And then I said, I want to be called Rip. Yeah, I want to be really invested. That's a good thing. he came to know Christ in prison. the story starts with him in lockdown, maximum lockdown, one hour a day. He gets in sunshine. The rest of it is in a cell. And, someone slipped a Bible into his cell. And the problem is that Rip doesn't read. He went all the way through high school sitting in the front row, listening really well, doing as best he could on tests, and barely graduated, but could not read a word until God told him, open up the Bible. He said, God, I can't read. Open the Bible. But God, you know, I can't read. Someone had, ah, introduced him to Christ, Open up the Bible. And he opened up the Bible and he could read. I want you to hear this story from him. this is cut 15.

>> Speaker H: I couldn't read it. I was 32 years old. I couldn't read.

>> Steve Jordahl: What was it like the first time you pick up a Bible and all of a sudden you realize you could understand what's going on? What was that like?

>> Speaker H: It was one. It was the most scariest thing because for the first time, just opening it, knowing it didn't take long for me to know. I was like, man, I closed the back as fast as I opened it, and I just knew. I knew I could read. And I was almost scared to open it again. I started trying to memorize verses. I. I did. I was writing them down, taking them out to the cage when I go for yard call, just in hopes if I can't read, I got something. I got.

>> Steve Jordahl: What, in case it goes away.

>> Speaker H: Yeah, man, I was scared.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, first of all, that's something we all take for granted, Being able to read the Bible, read God's word. So this. This sounds like this was a miraculous intervention.

>> Steve Jordahl: That's what he says it was. And, yeah, okay. And it wasn't the only one that he experienced there. So God laid on his heart that he wanted. He said, I want to be like, there's this guy. When I was in general lockdown before I became a Christian, he used to come around and he always used to be encouraging, and he used to say he'd pray for us. And he was always the positive side of things. And I wanted to be him. I didn't want to be the guy that got locked up. I wanted to be him. And so that started his journey. Someone, actually, Southern Baptist Seminary, New Orleans. Southern Baptist Seminary has started a ministry with prisoners that will allow them to take classes and become, like, full Master of divinity classes. Rip hadn't had those, but he did run into one of them and led him to Christ. and God laid on his heart. After he began to read, he said, I got to share this. I want to be influential, on these men. I have a heart for men. I want to go back to maximum lockdown. I want to minister to the guys.

>> Ed Vitagliano: In there where he was.

>> Steve Jordahl: Where he was. You don't just walk into maximum lockdown. You can't get in there. And the reason he was in there in the first place was beating up on a guard. He wasn't going to do that again. So how is he going to get back to where he wanted to go to minister to these people? Well, let's listen to how that happened. Cut 16.

>> Speaker H: I was like, I Want to go back to maximum lock now? I got to, I was walking down the walk one day, the same walk, very walk, you walk down and it was D building. You can't even go in this place. You couldn't even go in there then that's where I was locked down at. And I, and I could hear him say, go in there. And I'm like man, we, oh man, here we go. And I just felt the uncle. So I walk in and step in the door and just stand still like a statue thinking I'm m fixing it, I'm fixing to go back to lockdown. Nobody said nothing. And I walked down that long corridor and I got to the tower where it's three officers and they did not see me. They did not see me. And I just walk into maximum lockdown and I go talk to three men. Hey, how you doing? Lord love you. I will be back, I promise you. Then I ran out and left and I kept coming back every day and I started going to more and more sales. And then the warden called me one day. She was like, what are you doing in lockdown? I was like, just spreading the word of God.

Living Waters Baptist Church is in the middle of Marshall County Correctional facility

That's it. She was like, who told you you could do it? I said, God. And she said, well, keep going.

>> Steve Jordahl: The bottom line is he was chosen now as pastor of the church. Is Living Waters Baptist Church in the middle of Marshall County Correctional facility. They have 90 members. They have about 150 maybe that attend regularly. They baptize people. He preaches, he preached a great sermon when we were there Saturday night. And it's a full, it was accepted full membership into the Lafayette Marshall County Baptist Association. Usually a church has to go through a one year period of. We'll see.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Right in.

>> Fred Jackson: That's a great story. You know, during Sherithon we often hear and I've gotten letters from prisoners how God is using American Family Radio to get the gospel, into those facilities. And this is a great story, Steve. I'm glad you're bringing it to us because God is able and bars and walls do not stop the gospel. And you know, listening to Rip. Did Rip tell you how much time he has left inside?

>> Steve Jordahl: I didn't ask when he was getting out, but I asked what he was going to do when he did get out. And he says, I'm going to start a church on the outside of street church. the very first thing I'm going to do. I'm not, I am. This is me now. He says, my brother in Law. My brother has already offered me a job of remote detailing cars. So he's going to be able to make a little bit of living and then he's going to be a pastor in the street out there. and someone else will take over his. He's got deacons in this church. He's got elders in this church. Ah, someone else will take over his church inside.

>> Fred Jackson: Well, you know, through his experience in the past. And we don't need to know all the details about that. Obviously something happened that got him inside that prison, but God opened the door and has given Rick the heart to do this. And that's exciting.

>> Steve Jordahl: That really is the word of God. He so revered it and was so excited about it. He said, when I could read, all of a sudden I could read the word of God. God. It opened up. And how do I read this and apply it to my life? I need to. I need to know more.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Yeah, yeah, my, prison ministries are something that, For instance. Well, you know, my wife's uncle, who passed away, a few years ago, was very passionate about reaching men, in prisons. I mean, he was. Every Sunday, after we ate at my wife's grandmother, he was getting ready to go up to the prison ministry. And he started the one, local county we live in.

>> Ed Vitagliano: His name was Pat Ewing.

>> Tony Vitagliano: Pat Ewing. Yeah, locally. and through that, through that prison ministry, several others branched, off. So it's encouraging to hear these stories because that's a group of people. I mean, they need to hear the gospel too. A lot of them are in there for, terrible crimes, lesser crimes, but they need to hear the gospel also. And yesterday, at our church, we had a speaker come in, and he said something that just struck me. He said that, because we had a missionary, one of the missionaries our church supports came up and spoke, and she was from the Netherlands. And she mentioned how it was just a tough culture to reach with the gospel. And he made the statement. He said, jesus doesn't care about culture.

>> Fred Jackson: Yep.

>> Tony Vitagliano: He doesn't care about culture no matter what the cultural values are. How different radical it is from Western culture, even prison culture. That's what I'm thinking of. You know, Jesus doesn't care about what the culture is.

>> Ed Vitagliano: It doesn't exclude.

>> Tony Vitagliano: It doesn't exclude people. It doesn't matter. He can get in there and change, hearts and minds and do a work.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, this is a great story, Steve. Are you going to keep, keep up with what's happening with,

>> Steve Jordahl: I am he's going to be ordained in the coming months. I don't know when, but I'll. I'll be up there for that, too.

>> Ed Vitagliano: Well, keep us informed. When he does get out, he starts a church. We may have him on. Yeah, and, some people may want to support that word. Yeah, and I love that you can get a degree. You can get a. A degree from a seminary in prison.

>> Steve Jordahl: That's right.

>> Ed Vitagliano: That's the way to rehabilitate people. All right, folks, that's all the time. We've got more great radio directly ahead on American Family Radio. We'll see you tomorrow.