Hello and welcome to the Dr. Nursemama show, prescribing hope for healthy Families here on American Family Radio. Here's your host, professor, pediatric nurse practitioner, and mom of four, Dr. Jessica Peck.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, hey there, friends, and welcome to my favorite time of day, getting to spend time with you, prescribing Hope Hope for Healthy Families. I'm so glad to be with you. I hope that you all had a great weekend.
The mental health crisis is happening among children and adolescents especially, but also adults
And we have a really important topic to talk about today, and I'm anxious to dive into it. Everywhere I go, people are asking me about the mental health crisis that is happening among children and adolescents especially, but also among adults. Now, I was, on the front lines as a nursing leader during the COVID 19 pandemic. And I looked at pediatric healthcare professionals, particularly pediatric nurse practitioners who were working across the country, and we asked them about their experiences and they told us very early on during the pandemic, yes, we know there's a mental health crisis, and yes, it's as bad as people are saying, and it's going to get even worse. But more importantly than that, they said they saw the signs of mental health crisis emerging among kids, but they also saw them among their parents. They see their parents struggling. Parents are struggling with anxiety and depression. And we wonder what is a mental health disorder? What is normal on the human spectrum of emotion? And the bottom line is that we are living in a time of overwhelming mental health need. Everywhere we go, people are talking about it. And I always talk about this pendulum. There's this tension between it is normal to feel anxious at some point in your life. It is normal to feel depressed. It is also. There are also on the other end of that, there are situation, where that rises to the level of urgent or emergent or even a crisis level that needs professional intervention. But I see even in this country, I know that millions of people struggle with anxiety and depression, with trauma, big t trauma, those big events that happen, and little T trauma, those little events that happen. They may struggle with addiction to a wide variety of things, yet many never receive the professional help they so desperately need, even being able to recogn. Okay, I need some help. I need to talk about this issue. Many times when we're struggling with feelings of anxiousness, we're struggling with feelings of depression, or we're struggling with addiction or traumas, we keep those things very secret. Now, this is something that younger generations are doing a much better job of than we are. They're talking about it more than older generations are. But many times as adults we just sit in silence and we wonder, should I say anything? Should I not? Am, I do I just need to be tougher? Is my faith not strong enough? Is there something wrong with me? What will happen if I tell someone? And even when you tell someone that someone may be being a professional counselor, a professional mental health provider, the barriers are very steep. So first of all, you've got to actually say something and admit that you have a problem or admit that you need some extra help. Second, you've got to find somebody. And that finding somebody I find is very difficult to do. You think about is this person on, my insurance, how much do they cost? Will I have time off of work? How far away do they live? Will I be able to go to the that place? Is it virtual? Is it in person? Will someone see me there when I'm going there? And that's not even getting to the barrier of does this person share my worldview? Can I trust this person with the things that I'm struggling with the most? And can I trust them to guide me with wise biblical counsel? You can see where from my perspective as a healthcare professional, even if someone comes to me and I recognize they may need some extra help, whether that's biblical counseling, whether that's counseling from a social worker or a licensed marriage and family therapist, or a Christian counselor, or another mental healthcare provider, trying to actually find someone that meets all of those qualifications and then someone that you connect with, because that's important, important too. It's very rare. And so we see people continuing to struggle in silence. Now what I see also is that the church is often silent and we see this as siloed and we see this as a, a, paradigm of that. These two things are completely separate. But for me as a nurse practitioner, I look at a person, body, mind and soul. All of those things are interconnected. Our physical health impacts our mental health, that impacts our spiritual health. All of those things are combined together. And a lot of times I see the church being silent on a lot of these issues. And too many well intentioned Christians try, they try to help, but they just honestly lack the tools. And sometimes they cause unintentional harm and then that harms them because they feel badly about saying something that may have unintentionally caused a crisis of faith. Faith we may have, I see examples in youth groups a lot where teens may disclose a struggle that they have that may be a struggle with what they're watching, their relationships, the risk taking behaviors that they're having. There maybe it's risks with substances, maybe it's eating disorder. And many times as a life group leader, you're just not equipped and you don't know what to do. You want to help, your heart is to help, but you just don't know what to do. So today what we're going to talk, to talk about is what if the church could stand in that gap and provide wisdom and compassion and the power of God's word. And so today we're talking about a book that's coming out called the Care and Counsel Handbook. Now it's a quick reference guide of biblical answers for 100 real life issues. Now nothing is going to solve everything, but we can learn a little bit and we can have some clear and concise answers from God's word where we can stop, start to fill in the gap and start to learn some of those things that we know are evidence based from research. And I am very glad to introduce to you Dr. Eric Scalise. He's a counselor, a professor, a ministry leader with more than 45 years of experience. And he is joining us today to share how we can become safe, trusted people for those who are hurting and discover the life changing benefits of wise biblical counsel. And there are several contributors to this book. It is a, power packed for sure. We have some of you may be familiar with June Hunt and the work that she has done with Haley Scully and also with Dustin Anderson. But today we are joined by Eric Scalise. Eric, I'm so glad to have you here. Thanks so much for joining us.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: Thank you.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, thanks so much. We're going to test out your connection and make sure that we can hear you. Well. These are the joys and the trials of live radio for sure. Eric, tell us about this book and it will tell us a little bit about your background. Just start by telling us about you.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: well, thanks. I have been in the mental health space, academic mental health ministry space, like said, for 45 years now. A lot of it clinical, inpatient, psychiatric, had a private practice for 15 years, spent some time as department chair for counseling programs at Reedman University and but I'm with Hope for the Heart now which is a nonprofit, more of a ministry counseling orientation. And I love equipping and resourcing the church. So I'm in my happy place right now in that regard.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, Eric, you and I have had conversations, in person about this issue. You and I are both very passionate about this issue, about equipping lay leaders to respond in a way that is helpful for mental health. So talk a little bit about what you see. I just gave a little synopsis of what I see as people having mental health issues, but often just siloed. It's like, it's separate. It's like, maybe I'm going to handle this with a mental health care provider, but we're not going to talk about it at church. Or maybe the opposite way, where people think, oh, the church is the only thing that you need here. How can we have that both and approach? And how do you see this guide help to equip the church to stand in that gap?
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: Right. Great question. I, I often say if Covid was the earthquake that shook the world, then the mental health aftermath is the tsunami that followed. And, the tsunami was greater than the original event. And so for the last four or five years, the country has wrestled serious mental health issues. Historically, the church tends to shy away from this. Pastors are often not trained as counselors. They get uncomfortable talking about things like depression and anxiety, because they're looking for faith applications with something that might be a little bit more complex than that. I think Covid stripped away a little bit of that out of necessity. and I, I'm hopeful that pastors will have the tough conversations and provide the services and the ministry that is needed. It's not an either or, like you said, it's a both. And you know, we need competently trained mental health, practitioners. But the church, capital C can do a lot.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Absolutely. I completely agree that it's a both and approach. And I think that when we silo those two issues, we really unintentionally kind of increase some of the shame and stigma that goes along with feeling anxious with maybe you are seeing a counselor. Now, we know that there are churches that do have great models of providing counseling within the framework of the church. And many even employ or have volunteers from professional mental health care providers. And sometimes that is absolutely needed. But what we're talking about is those people who are getting those professional source resources, or maybe those who know that they need them but can't yet access them, or maybe those who don't yet know that they need those mental health resources. How do we as the church come alongside and provide that spiritual support? Now, in this book, as I, as I've read it, there's a pretty robust framework. You kind of really talk people through. Okay, we're going to talk about all of these issues. And there are a ton of issues in Here that we'll talk through a little bit. But you give them some core concepts, some core things to understand. Before you even start going through those. Give us an overview of that framework.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: It's a wonderful model that I think God gave the tune m and it's sort of a four part model. There are over a, hundred different topics in the book. some of them may be clinical oriented, but many of them just real life, like anger, like hopelessness, worry, fear. So it really covers the basis. But you take any topic take and the first way we talk about it is let's define it. What does God's word have to say about the subject of science? So let's talk about followed by characteristics. What does it look like? What does it sound? like what does this feel like? So people can understand what they might be facing or their loved one might be facing. Then it's cause what's the deuces by what makes for mine. And then finally steps the solution certainly, because provide biblical truth out of God's word. But I think June's middle name is practical. And so it's also very, very practical. It might be something like perhaps you need to go and get a physical. Maybe it would help you talk to a counselor. Maybe it has something to do with your speech. So there are factors, as well as the biblical ones. Every one of the topics covered this book, I'll just remind people it's a quick reference guide. So these are short, pieces of the full topic. We have hundred page books on every topic. So if someone wanted to take a much deeper dive into faith, they can get the full, what we call part of our Key for living library.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Absolutely. And I want to thank our listeners for hanging in there with us. I know we're having a little trouble with the audio Again. Welcome to the joys of live radio. We are talking to you live here, but I'm talking to Dr. Eric Scalise about his new book that's coming out, the Care and Counsel Handbook, a quick reference guide of biblical answers for 100 real life issues. We know there's a mental health crisis today. We know there is a gap between what people need and what they're actually receiving in support. And we know that biblical counseling matters. Wise, biblically grounded counsel can provide hope and clarity, clarity and direction to someone in crisis. And we know that putting this book in your hands will help you to be better equipped to meet people at their point of need and to equip the church to respond and perhaps even redefine the church's role in mental health response. We'll be right back.
Preborn has helped save 38,000 babies this year
On the other side of this break, I want you to picture this. Her name is Kayla. She is 17, alone, terrified and pregnant, sitting in a clinic, tears blurring, thinking abortion is her only option until she was offered a free ultrasound, paid for by a hero just like you. The moment Kayla heard her baby's heartbeat, the decision was made. And today her little baby boy, Gabrielle is thriving because preborn walked with Kayla every step of the way. Way. Now multiply that by 38,000. That's how many babies preborn has helped save just this year. How many mothers preborn has come alongside with practical and spiritual resources to make motherhood possible. But here's the most important thing you will hear today. Their goal is to save 70,000 by the end of the year and they can't do it without us. Every $28 provides that ultrasound. The moment everything changes, will you be the reason the next Kayla chooses life? The reason Gabrielle fulfills his destiny? To donate, dial pound 250 and say the keyword baby. That's pound 250, baby. Or donate securely at preborn.com/AFR, that's preborn.com/AFR. You're listening to the Doctor Nurse Mama show with Dr. Jessica Peck on American Family Radio.
American Family Radio is talking about equipping the church to respond to mental health crisis
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Welcome back, friends. We are here and we are live. And sorry if you were waiting for the, the music. I was waiting for it too, but that's okay. We're having some technical troubles today. What else would it be if we didn't have technical troubles on live radio? This is just spiritual warfare. And I feel like there is opposition to the message that we're trying to today and that is equipping the church to respond to the mental health crisis. And the truth is the mental health crisis in our culture is staggering. So many people are hurting. I know many of you out there listening right now are hurting yourselves. You know someone very close to you who is hurting. And too few find the help that they need. And while some absolutely need professional intervention, there's also a huge gap where the church could stay, could and should step up and step in. They can offer support and hope and biblical truth alongside that journey that someone's happening, that someone's having. Now, unfortunately, without training or guidance, even well meaning Christians can unintentionally wound those they are trying to help. And I have sat with people who have said something that they really mean well, but then they realize later maybe that wasn't helpful in the moment. And I don't want people to feel frozen with fear and feel like they can't respond. So we have good news for you. The church doesn't have to stay silent or uninformed. And I'm talking today about a new resource that's coming out called the Care and Counsel Handbook. It is a quick reference guide of biblical answers for 100 real life issues. Now, for those of you who are fans of exploring the word here on American Family Radio, the format kind of reminds me of that and looking at getting some answers for how do you walk people through so many of these issues? Now? There's as many. Dr. Scalise said there's more than a hundred issues in this book. And just looking down the list, we're talking about abuse, recovery, about adoption, abortion, adultery, aging well, alcohol and drug abuse, Alzheimer's and dementia, anger, anorexia, anxiety, assurance of salvation, and atheism. And that is just the A's, my friend. There are a lot more subjects in there. This handbook provides some practical biblical insights on more than 100 issues and giving everyday believers the tools to care wisely and well. Now, for those of you who've been following my series that I've been doing on Hope for the, Broken Champions, for the Brokenhearted, we have been talking to Nick Vujicic You can go to nick V Ministries. Dr. Eric Scalise helped write some of the curriculum. Same kind of principle. How do we equip the church for response? And Eric Scalise today is here representing hope for the heart and bringing. He brings decades of clinical experience and ministry leadership to show us how the church can rise up, meet people where they are, and offer the life giving hope of Christ. So, Dr. Scalise, we're going to check and see. Can you hear me okay? Do we have you on the line? I feel like we're about to do a cell phone commercial.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: I can hear you.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: If you can hear me, I can hear you.
Jessica, this resource is good for lay counselors and ministry leaders and pastors
Okay, well, let's pick it back up where we were and talk about the framework for this, for this book. What, what is it that you hope that people will do before we start to dive into some of the topics?
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: This resource just Jessica, we found is.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: Something that's good for, not just, let's call them lay counselors and ministry leaders and pastors. But I've often found that clinical clinicians.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: Get some benefit out of it because I often like to say this is what you didn't get in graduate school. Even in Christian universities when they're preparing you for a license, you don't have the luxury of taking a deep dive into biblical integration. And so it really has a pretty wide spectrum of use. Some years ago I did, I wrote a book with a colleague of mine on lay counseling and I did a lot of the updated research and we found out that a competently trained lay counselor, someone who probably didn't have any letters after their last name, had about the same outcome measures as a licensed clinician. So let me say it again. A competently trained lay counselor in most presenting cases had about the same outcome measures as a licensed, highly trained clinician. My professional colleagues didn't want to hear that, but it was true. And when it comes to things like grief, loss, worry, my, my teenagers driving me crazy, we're having some marital communication issues. And I started digging into the research a little bit more to ask the question why? And here's what we discovered. The overwhelming determining factor has everything to do with the quality of relationship between the person seeking help and the one offering it. And I thought, you know what, the average person can learn this.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: In other words, the church be equipped. To be good listeners to practice the ministry of presence, to know how to handle the word of God and bring in his truth, and to create a safe, supportive environment so people can talk again. It's not, it's not a, reason not to seek out professional help. It's not either or, it's both and, but the church can do a lot.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: That research was really astounding to me. And you're right, it's not either or, it's a both and, and speak to that tension of needing. Some people do need professional help and some people, you know, just need that supportive relationship to come along to speak that biblical wise counseling. How do you know where you are on that continuum? How would you answer that question?
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: One of the things we do in our training is to help people understand lay people. We're not training you to be therapists, we're training you to be come alongside people who are like those first responders. And part of the role of first responders is to get you into the kind of help you might need and so you learn how to make an appropriate referral. I think every church should know the faith based mental health practitioners in their community and develop relationships so they have referrals if they need it. And I think that's critical to it. When I used to teach incoming graduate students who are all excited about starting private practice and seeing clients, I would say to them, listen, you're going to see your client maybe an hour A week, maybe once every two weeks. There are 168 hours in a week. And that person's going to need a lot more attention and support than you can provide. You have to connect with the local church and resources there to walk alongside with you while you do some of the deeper work that that person needs.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: that's absolutely right. I completely agree with that and that's why I'm so excited about having that wraparound support. Now, Dr. Scalise, talk about, talk about the tension that is there for the layperson. People who want to help, but who might be afraid to help. They might be afraid to say something that might, you know, be harmful unintentionally, or might, unintentionally represent themselves as providing professional help when they're not. At the same time, the other end of it is saying nothing and just sitting there in silence. How do we get to a healthy balance where we're saying things that are helpful, that are in our lane as just that supportive relationship
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: Well, this handbook is our attempt to provide a very practical resource tool for the lay counselor so they feel like they can engage with people at some level, not to be a therapist, but to be a good listener, a come alongside helper. And, and that's the whole point behind doing this, this particular handbook. And, and we, we often talk about how do you then bring other resources in around you and, and you, you, you take away the notion that you're going to be a therapist because you're not. Don't tell them that they're going to. Now the flip side of that, I've also seen people where they go to a weekend seminar or something and feel like they know everything and they can create more problems and pain for a person than is necessary. That's why I said the research says a competently trained lay counselor. And so you have to give them some tools, some content, some context in order for them to know how to have a conversation with someone. They're struggling with anger or worry or fear. And even myself as a licensed clinician, even though I don't practice right now, I have to be able to recognize that someone sitting in front of me, their situation is beyond my ability to care for them. You take someone who, anorexic, bulimic, they might need to be in a hospital. You take someone who is experiencing psychosis, meaning they're hallucinating. That, that doesn't mean I, even as a licensed person, can deal with it. So it doesn't matter where you're on the Spectrum. You need to know where your referral sources are.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: And no matter where you are, the truth is that God's word is powerful. And even in looking through this book you take different issues and you break down. What does the Bible say about this? What is the role of scripture in meeting someone's mental health needs?
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: The scripture has a lot to say about a lot of things.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: And in, in one way it's almost like a mental health resource book all its own. And people don't realize that God's Word provides many insights and wise counsel. And I don't know if you're familiar or not with the work of Dr. Harold Koenig out of Duke University. he leads the center for Spirituality. He's a, he's a trained licensed psychiatrist. He's probably one of the most renowned researchers in the country on the impact of faith and wellness. And because he's at a secular university, he has to study all religions. But he spends most of his time researching the impact of Christian worldview. Every piece of research he's done shows that faith is the secret sauce, that it impacts physical, emotional, cognitive and relational well being. And so the church needs to understand that the word of God does make a difference and research is actually on our side that proves it.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: You're right. It doesn't matter if you look at faith based research or secular research. All of that research affirms, research generally affirms, the role of faith in our life. The role of faith practices, the health impacts of prayer, of scripture reading, of being involved in a church body together. All of those things are so important. And that's why, you know, I keep saying this Eric, that it's distressing to me to see these two things so siloed. And we've got to figure out ways to build bridges there because it can be a really hot topic where people have, like you said, maybe they go to a seminar and then they think, okay, well I know every, everything, there is no about this. Or they have preconceived notions or fears about those things. But meanwhile, while we're having all of these arguments about this, about the role of professional counseling versus lay counseling versus biblical counseling, all of those things, and the origin of mental health disorders and what they actually are and how they're treated. What I see, Eric, is real families struggling with real problems in real time. And there. And I see that that's why the book that I wrote was called Behind Closed Doors, because I see a lot of these people in my community Who I know have really strong faith, but they come and they're struggling with mental health conditions and there is a lot of shame and stigma and speaking out about that. Now, one of the great things about equipping people to respond to those situations, whether it's mental health condition like one of the ones that you've read in there, is that there's vicarious benefit. Yes, it will help equip you to speak to people who, you know, may be struggling with anxiety or depression. I'm just using those repeatedly because those are the most common. But you're also going to help a lot of other people who you may not know are struggling or who may not have had the courage yet to speak their struggle or may not even have the words yet to describe that. So explain that.
Dr. Eric Scalise says pastors have a critical role in helping destigmatize mental health issues
Tell me about the vision that you have for equipping the church body and what you're doing in your hope for the heart ministry. If it is, if it exceeds your expectations, if, if your vision is fulfilled, what would that look like in the church body?
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: pastors are gate keepers of sorts, and, and they have a critical role to help destigmatize the mental health issues that are out there. Years ago, Jessica, a, church I was part of had a big banner inside the sanctuary as it led out to the foyer to, and it said, now entering the mission field. And I was talking to the pastor outside and he was running a counseling situation by me. And I looked at him and I said, bill, you know what? That banner that's inside the sanctuary, it belongs on both sides of the door. because there's as much pain sitting in those pews every Sunday as there are out in our community. And that in, in, you need to help destigmatize and let people. It's okay. I was speaking at a pastor's conference, a little bit about mental health. And I said, I'm going to give all of you your sermon this Sunday. And it's just a, three word sermon. Well, everyone you know got out a piece of paper, their cell phone to take a note, and I said, would you get into your pulpit, look as lovingly as you can at your congregation and just say, shame off you. We got, we have shame on you down pretty pat. And when it comes to things like depression and anxiety and I wrestle with suicide or I have not resolved childhood sexual abuse, people don't know what to do with it. The research says that one out of every three girls and one out of every four to five boys will experience some form of abuse before they graduate from high school. We can't pretend that's not sitting in the church every Sunday. Every third or fourth person you look at is wrestling with it.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Absolutely. You know, Eric, I'm going to stop you right there because we're right in the middle of a very important point and we're just getting started. Thanks, guys for hanging in there with us through the technical issues. This is a really important Message and what Dr. Scalise is saying is true. There are hurting people in the pews in your community and we have a resource today to help you speak words of life into that. We'll be right back with more from Dr. Eric Scalise, one of the co authors of the Care and Counsel Handbook, a quick reference guide of biblical answers for 100 real life issues. We'll see you on the other side of this break.
Dr. Carl Trueman: Reformers believed that everything must be checked against scripture
Dr. Carl Trueman from the American Family Studios documentary the God who Speaks.
>> Dr. Carl Trueman: Typically, what Sola Scriptur or what scripture alone means for the reformers is this. We accept the church tradition as an authoritative statement of Christian faith and practice as long as it lines up with scripture. That's not the equivalent of the it's just me and my Bible attitude that we often find in evangelicalism today. It's we belong to a historic tradition, but we always need to check what the church is teaching in light of scripture. So scripture alone doesn't mean the only book I read is the Bible. Scripture alone means that the Bible is the ultimate principle by which everything the church ever says or does is to be checked.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: Visit thegodwhospeaks.org.
>> Hard Fought Hallelujah by Brandon Lake: And Times that it costs There's days when a praise comes out easy, days when it takes all the strength I got. I'll bring my hard-fought heartfelt, been through hell. Hallelujah. Dr. Jessica Peck Welcome back, friends. That is Hard Fought Hallelujah by Brandon Lake.
The church is uniquely positioned to care for those struggling with mental health issues
And you know, we're talking today about some tough things that people are going through. What are you fighting right now? What do you see that your friends, your loved ones, your family, people who are in your Sunday school group, your life group, your church body, what are they struggling with? We are facing an unprecedented wave of mental health struggles in our world and far too many people slip through the cracks and they don't get that professional help that they need. And meanwhile, the church is uniquely positioned to be a place of care. Yet too often it remains absent or under equipped. And while good intentions abound, I want to emphasize that I know that for most people, most church leaders, they mean well, but they're overwhelmed and maybe a little afraid. And the truth is that sometimes uninformed counsel can actually do harm. Silence does harm. Uninformed counsel does harm. So where do we find the grace in the middle? Well, we do that through God's Word.
The Care and Counsel Handbook provides biblical answers for 100 real life issues
And I want to read to you a short excerpt from this book we're talking about the Care and Counsel Handbook, a quick reference guide of biblical answers for 100 real life issues. And it says, God's Word, the foundation of effective care and counsel. Where do you go for information for answers and direction, comfort and support, wise counsel and truth, God's heartbeat on a matter for the Christ follower. It's God's Word, the Bible. There is no greater treasure in all the universe. Indeed, His Word is for all people, for he is not far from any one of us. Acts 17:27. He gave us the Scriptures so that we would have clear guidance, constant encouragement, and enduring hope. Romans 15:4 says, Everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through the endurance taught in the Scriptures and the encouragement they might provide, they provide, we might have hope. A foundational Bible verse to reflect on and lean into is found in 1st Kings 22:5. First seek the counsel of the Lord. And for those who have given their lives to Christ, it's a firm foundation. This is what we're talking about today. How does the church come alongside those members who are struggling? How do you learn what God's Word says about these struggles that we have in this world? And as I shared with you, there are 100 issues. I think even a little more than a hundred issues, all kinds of things that people will face in the world. It gives you biblical perspective on words of life that you can speak. Now, speaking words of counsel from the Bible is usually going to be much wiser than your own counsel, although sometimes Scripture can be misused and misapplied as well. So we're talking today to Dr. Eric Scalise, and he's a seasoned counselor and leader and he works with hope for the heart. And Eric, I would love for you to talk about some of the framework of all of these issues. There are so many issues, you don't even have to read it through, you know, in one sitting. You can just use it as a handbook as issues come up for biblical counsel. How is each section organized? How does it equip the reader to be able to speak words of life on really tough issues that people are facing?
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: It's a great book to have on your desk or on your shelf, especially if you work a Lot with people as a pastor, ministry leader, small group leader, even licensed clinician. And we try to give you enough information to have a conversation with people across these hundred topics, knowing there is a complete, roughly 100 page book on each of those topics. Obviously you can't, you have to have a thousand page book. Wouldn't I? So we can't do that. No, it would be a 10,000 page book. But anyway, they're framed in a four parts and we talked about it. First there is the definitions. You have to look at what is God's definition? What does the word of God say about some? Take anger. If you said, Eric, what's anger? I might describe it as yelling and screaming and a red face. Someone else might say, no, anger is when I get punched in the face. Let's look at what God's word says defines anger, rage and those kinds of things. And then we look at the characteristics. What is anger? How does it manifest? All the ways. Then we look at causes, what produces anger in people, what produces that frustration that leads to angry responses. And then once you've defined it and explained it, the million dollar question is, okay, what do I do with it? And that last section is Steps to Solution. Let's find the biblical solutions with the right practical applications. So people begin to find the way through whatever they're facing. Not necessarily out of, but through it.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: That is so helpful. And in looking at it, you know, I think that there are a lot of issues that people think, well, does the Bible really speak about that? Because the Bible was written, you know, thousands of years ago and some people have trouble seeing the relevance in everyday life. But you know, Eric, I've seen the world, especially for children, change so dramatically in the last five years. And kids are facing threats that they have never faced before. And I see a lot of grandparents who feel very helpless to help to speak into that because they think, I don't know what it's like to have social media. I don't know what it's like to live on, camera 24 7. I don't know about cyberbullying or sexting or of these things that kids have to face. But you know what I find, Eric, is that the heart of the issue is the same. And they may not know about social media, but they know about comparison. They know about shame, they know about self esteem. They know about those things that the Bible is pretty clear about. And doing a Bible study right now, on the life of David, who of course is called a man after God's own heart. And there are things that David did that were not, were clearly not after God's own heart. But David was so transparent before the Lord and he was so repentant for the sin that was there. And sometimes these things can be a sin. These things are always a sin issue. Sometimes it's your own sin and sometimes it's the sin of someone else who causes trauma and hurt on you. And it may not be your fault, but it is your responsibility to seek guidance, talk about how those core issues, those human experiences and emotions and that we read about and are advised about in Scripture are unchanged. And they're just as relevant in our lives today as they were in King David's life when he wrote the Psalms.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: As an aside, Jessica, I think that's why so many people get so much out of the book of Psalms. We feel like we're almost reading David's journal as he works through real life issues. Sometimes he's up and excited and full of faith, and sometimes he's quite despondent and he's asking, where are you, God? Why is this happening? I don't like this. And it's raw and it's real. And so you can go through the pages of Scripture even thousands of years ago with people and you can say, oh, so and so wrestled with anger, so and so wrestled with dysfunctional relationships, so and so wrestled with worry or depression. And so the human condition hasn't changed. We're, we're all subject to our fallen nature. And yet we've been created in relationship through relationship and for relationship. And so isolation, in my opinion, is one of the enemy's major strategies to take somebody out. And that you mentioned, young people suicide is the leading cause of second leading cause of death among our young people after accidents. And Covid exacerbated that issue because schools were closed. And Jessica, you know this. Children up to adolescents, they learn their social skills and their identity and self worth issues through that interaction relationally. And they were cut off. I've heard some people say we may have lost an entire generation of our kids because of that. You throw technology into the equation, we don't know how to unplug. I often say we might be the most technologically connected society ever, but the most relationally disconnected ever. And isolation fuels loneliness and depression, anxiety and many of these human conditions that people wrestle with. And a book like this hopefully provides some resources and answers to those questions.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: You and I, our hearts are just beating together on this issue.
Every youth ministry should be doing something to prepare its lay leaders for these issues
I know people don't want to talk about COVID Covid happened. We're almost at, six years past covet. But I agree with your assessment. And even in writing about it and talking about it, I realize I've been talking about it more this year than I even did in the last couple of years prior. And I think that's because we're finally starting to see the smoke clear and starting to see the damage that was done. The psychological, mental health injury, the social and emotional injury that was inflicted on a generation of children. And Eric, I say this all the time. You know, we think past generations ask, where were you on V E Day? Where were you built and Pearl harbor was attacked? Where were you when JFK was shot? When the Challenger exploded? When 9, 11 happened? This generation, I've heard it in real time. They ask you, they ask each other, where were you in the world shut down? Where were you in quarantine? What was your experience? Then it is defined a generation. I literally have goosebumps even in talking about it. And I think that every youth ministry, and especially youth ministry, every church in general, but every ministry for youth should be doing something to prepare its lay leaders to deal with these very heavy issues that youth are facing. It is just not enough to have them siloed. We cannot sit on the sidelines and say, we'll pray about that more. Well, you know, make your faith stronger. Well, it'll be okay. We can't just give these glib answers, but we can't be therapists. But we've got to stand in the gap. So I think every youth ministry needs to be doing something intentionally to equip your lay leaders to respond. And this book, I think is a great first step because it covers so many different things all through the lens of scripture and helps to give some wisdom in that. And I think that that is really, really important to do. So tell us, what do you think is unique about this particular resource in providing and the equipping of those lay leaders different from other resources that may be there? Like you said, the 10,000 pages where we be overwhelmed with,
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: I've been in this space a long time and so I have a sense of what's out there resource wise. And I have to honestly say, not just because I'm part of Hope for the Heart, but I've never seen a resource like this that is this comprehensive. It's not that other ministries and other organizations don't have great content. You think of Focus on the Family. They have a lot of things about marriage and family and, new life ministries and others have lots of great content about addiction and substance abuse. But I don't know of anyone that covers a hundred plus topics in terms of the breadth of coverage combined with a depth of biblical integration into every one of those topics. I've told our staff this is something that God has given to us to steward and, and when I first got here some years ago, I looked at June and I said, june, the Lord has used you to mine gold out, of the scripture for decades. And I smiled at her and I said, it's time to make a little jewelry out of it. And, you know, to me this handbook is, is a nice necklace or, you know, it's a piece of jewelry, that highlights getting into God's word.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, I think somewhere along the way we have lost what was written to us in the scripture. Just as you really beautifully described, Eric. The Psalms are gut wrenching. I mean, and it is like his journals. I had a guest last week, we were talking about this. How many of you would publish your prayers of confession for your, for your church to sing? But that was the kind of humility that, that David had, the kind of authenticity that he had. And so I think we need to have some of that in our churches. Not this sterile environment like, you know, it's so cliche. But people will say the church is not a museum for saints, it is a hospital for sinners. But if you're going to invite some of those disclosures, some of that sharing of the pain, you've got to be equipped to respond. You can't just invite it and open it up and not be equipped to respond. Right, right.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: and part of the message of Jesus's life was he gets it. He was a man of sorrows, acquainted with grief. He suffered real pain on the cross. It wasn't just metaphorical.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: He.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: He experienced real rejection. in PI inherit in Pilate's portico, people yelling for him to be crucified. He sweat real drops of blood. He was really crucified. And, and Hebrew says, we, we don't have a high priest who we have this passed through the heavens, who can't sympathize and understand our needs because he's lived and experienced what we have yet without sin. So therefore, let us draw near to the throne of grace to receive grace and help or mercy in our time of need. And Jesus, like all of us, in the middle of a trial, asked why question questions.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: He did.
>> Dr. Eric Scalise: He asked a why question on the cross, didn't he? And we can talk about that after break if you want.
>> Dr. Jessica Peck: Well, we do. And we're already at the end of our time together. And so if you want to know more about that why question, the why questions, pick up a copy of the Care and Counsel Handbook, a quick reference guide of biblical answers for 100 real life issues. Eric, that was such a profound word. I thank you so much for sharing that with with us. Thanks for sticking with us with the technical issues. And may the Lord bless you and keep you. Make his face shine upon you. I'll see you right here tomorrow.
>> Jeff Chamblee: The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
